Relations to Egypt

Parliamentary elections are expected to take place in Egypt in November - the first polls since former President Hosni Mubarak was toppled. Egypt's largest and most influential Islamic group, the Muslim Brotherhood, is a favorite going into the elections.

DW: The German perception of events in Egypt has shifted. First there was the "Facebook Generation" - young, modern urban people fighting for their rights. Now, Germany sees the emergence of Salafi Islamists and the Muslim Brotherhood, and recently the Israeli embassy was stormed. Do Germany and Europe have to get used to working together with completely new partners in the future?

Kerstin Müller: Definitely, but of course with a completely different, self-confident Egypt. I think that the majority of people there want to take the path of democracy. But they will press harder for solutions, for example in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. They won't automatically do everything the West wants, the way Mubarak did to a certain extent. If the Muslim Brotherhood in future is to play a greater role as a result of a high voter turnout at the next elections, we shouldn't panic and freeze funds or something like that. I think that we should try to press these forces to continue on the path of democratic reforms.

If the Muslim Brotherhood were to win the elections, as many believe, under which circumstances would cooperation with them be imaginable? And which circumstances would perhaps be inconceivable from a European perspective?

Of course, the decision lies in the hands of the Egyptians themselves. For our part, we have to wait for the elections. But I think we should cooperate with a government that may have a strong Muslim Brotherhood influence, provided that it sets clear signals that it will share the responsibility of democratizing the country and bringing it forward.

On the one hand, we see a tendency in Egypt of the Muslim Brotherhood gaining significance over the past months. On the other hand, we also see the military as a growing force. Is Egypt perhaps moving in the direction of a country that could be controlled by the military in the long-term?

I don't believe that it's determined yet what role the military will play in Egypt in the long run. Right now, the military council is at the helm. It determines how much democracy will be admitted and how much won't be. The electoral law, for example, was essentially suggested by the military. It is by far not as progressive as the one in Tunisia. The Egyptian military wants to continue to determine important steps and secure its power. The military also has economic power and wants to secure those structures. That is very precarious and we will have to continue to follow very closely which path Egypt takes here.

The organization Reporters without Borders has criticized the Egyptian military over its handling of freedom of speech. Is this an issue where Europe should speak out now or would such a protest from outside be perceived as undue interference?

It would certainly be perceived as interference. But I think that it would nevertheless be right. Right now there are still military tribunals and military jurisdiction. Human rights organizations have told us that people taken into custody during the revolution - because the military considers them guilty of misconduct - continue to be sentenced in fast-track trials in Egypt. This can't go on. This non-standard jurisdiction has to come to an end. There have to be fair proceedings.

An independent justice system is a very important step which Egypt has to take on the way to democratization. I think it is our task as Europeans to call for and broach this issue.

Could Europe accept an Egypt that defines itself as an Islamic democracy?

That of course depends on how it is formed. A theocracy like in Iran would not match our notion and would also not be acceptable.

Do you think this is conceivable in Egypt?

No, I don't see this danger. But there is the model of Turkey: a democracy which is strongly Muslim-influenced, but nevertheless has a secular constitution. Turkey shows that Islam and democracy are compatible. The question is always, how will it present itself in practice? For me, for example, it would also be important to know what the reference to Sharia law in the constitution would in practice mean for the role of women in society.

Of course, the Egyptians ultimately have to decide on such questions themselves. But we can exert influence - and we should, because we have an interest in democracy developing there. I think the main pillars of the Egyptian revolution want that as well. But ultimately, the Egyptian people will have to decide.

Interview: Rainer Sollich (sac)
Editor: Rob Mudge